Whirlpool

Hi guys,

Been working on a new guide for the SPA-3102; I have also referenced this in the SPA-3000 Simplified Guide Sticky, but thought it handy to have here also, for future search results etc.

Anyway, you can view/download at www.jmgtechnology.com.au/spa_3102_guide.pdf

Size at the moment is a bit of 1MB.

Still a few old Sipura screen shots in some of the appendixes but I will get rid of those and replace with the Linksys ones in the next day or two.

Cheers,
Jason

So what was the overall verdict on this box Jason ?

ta - Shaun

Shaun,

Pretty much same as SPA-3000; just with the added router. It seems to have T38 for fax but I don't use a fax machine so cannot test how well it works.

Initial testing of the QoS tells me that it does work but not as well as I would have liked. I need a bit more time to play with it though I think before I can say for sure. When uploading a large file the callee was complaining that my voice sounded like I was speaking under water. Their voice was perfect though. The QoS is the same as on the SPA-2100 so I might try on of those for a comparison. I might need to tweak a few other settings to get it working right..

If you are familiar with their other units, its more of the same :) As you can see from my guide the menus in the web interface are almost the same.

This unit would be ideal for people with single port modems who want to get into VoIP with all the goodies :)

The other good thing with this unit is that the LAN port is 100 not 10 base like the SPA-2100.

Cheers,
Jason

Could you include a screen shot of the Router web page... Given that is the main difference between the SPA-3000 and SPA-3102

Thanks
Michael

JMG Jason writes...

When uploading a large file the callee was complaining that my voice sounded like I was speaking under water. Their voice was perfect though.

Jason,
I sometime have the same problem with SPA3000. Do you have this problem? and if you did, how did you fix it? Should I be looking for a router with QOS?

Cheers,

Michael writes...

Could you include a screen shot of the Router web page

Yes for sure. I will get then done tomorrow. The units seem to be shipping with no quick start guide at the moment so I thought I would rush through a version of my guide for it.

JOATMON writes...

Should I be looking for a router with QOS

JOATMON,

Yep, I would suggest you look into a router with QoS if this is problem for you. The SPA-3102 has a built in router with QoS. Having said that the best method is probably just to pause the upload while your on a VoIP call.. It may be the easiest and cheapest option :)

Cheers,
Jason

JMG Jason writes...

nitial testing of the QoS tells me that it does work but not as well as I would have liked...... my voice sounded like I was speaking under water. Their voice was perfect though. The QoS is the same as on the SPA-2100 so I might try on of those for a comparison. I might need to tweak a few other settings to get it working right..

I remember reading a review somewhere of the 2100 and one of the QoS modes on that was "iffy" and the other "prefect" from the review, can't recall which mode or where the review is.

amgay writes...

that was "iffy" and the other "prefect"

I tried them both out, one did seem better than the other. I will try to track down that review and have a read.

No ideas on when/where you read it? I'll google it.. Should be able to find it I guess :)

JMG Jason writes...

The other good thing with this unit is that the LAN port is 100 not 10 base like the SPA-2100.

I haven't tried one but it seems the SPA2102 is just a SPA2100 with 100baseT ports unlike the SPA2100 which is 10baseT or is there something else different?

S.

sweetpea writes...

SPA2102 is just a SPA2100 with 100baseT

Looks like its just a SPA-2100 with the 100baseT.. I have not seen that unit before. I will look into it.

Also looks like a SPA-3100 exists... I have not seen that one either.. I will do some investigating..

Regarding iffy and good QOS settings, I read perhaps the same article that claimed TBF better than CBQ but it did not state why.

I have 3102 - first VOIP product I have successfully tried.
Easy to set-up.
Depending on the config, the call quality appears to be as good as PSTN, but there are so many variables, that I can't consistently get the same result.
G726-32 seems to me to be the best,
G711a is meant to be best but I am getting some fuzz with it,
G729 appears to be sometimes good sometimes not.

Some of them really fall apart when the person at the other end of the PSTN has a cordless phone.

It does not work setting the SPA3102 to the desired codec, the provider setting overrides this. So if I have SPA set to G711 and Pennytel set to G729, then make the call, then look at the call status, it will be G729.

So I have to change the settings at Oztell/Pennytell to try the different codecs.
There is a noticeable difference between them. I have called various friends and tried different codecs on each one. But as I said, the best codec to one destination may be different to the best codec for another. I have settled on G726-40 as my default on my SPA-3102 and set pennytel and oztell to g726.

Wayne...

JMG Jason writes...

I have also referenced this in the SPA-3000 Simplified Guide

Hi Jason,
I have SPA3K, Netgear DG834GT, Netgear ADSL filter/splitter with extel and oztell.Does the simplified guide apply to any ISP/VOIP in Australia? Thanks

There is a review on Tom's Networking that discusses the performance of the two QOS settings in a review of the SPA-2100. The 2100 is a 2-port FXS ATA, with built-in router, likely the same or similar router that is included in other hardware offerings in the SPA line, such as the 2102, 3102, etc.

In any case, the results of actual measurement taken comparing the performance of TBF vs CBQ settings are shown on this page: www.tomsnetworking.com/2...a2100/page4.html

JMG Jason writes...

Anyway, you can view/download at www.jmgtechnology.com.au/spa_3102_guide.pdf


You'll want to update the NTP timeserver reference, which is now in Router/Wan Setup.

Might be helpful to mention in App D that the computer needs to be on the same subnet (eg. 192.168.1) as the SPA. The firmware utility doesn't bother to tell you that until after you've typed in all the numbers.

JMG Jason writes...

No ideas on when/where you read it? I'll google it.. Should be able to find it I guess :)

Sorry it was over a month ago, I read so much it can take me hours to find something like that again, with no bookmark or history.

AbNormal writes...

www.tomsnetworking.com/2...a2100/page4.html

ar I believe that is it, you make life more, well easy.

Oh and if there is a setting to lower the mtu to say to 576 or lower try that, ideally 10ms of your internet connection. Most consumer grade QoS routers won't break large packets to reduce their impact in time and let smaller RTP packets through. Worked on my billion7402vgp.

JMG Jason writes...

If you are familiar with their other units, its more of the same

So, does this mean less-than-perfect PSTN quality or have they worked on that?

Jean-Luke writes...

So, does this mean less-than-perfect PSTN quality or have they worked on that?

I have only made and received a few calls, but I can't tell any difference in quality from my SPA3K. But, as I have said in other threads, I don't have a huge issue with PSTN quality other than its a little quieter than normal..

I am going to try to get the QoS working properly over the weekend, so I will do some more testing and tweaking with PSTN quality then. The unit still seems to do the internal conversion rather than switching the line with a relay though..

JMG Jason writes...

Hi guys,Been working on a new guide for the SPA-3102; I have also referenced this in the SPA-3000 Simplified Guide Sticky, but thought it handy to have here also, for future search results etc.Anyway, you can view/download at www.jmgtechnology.com.au/spa_3102_guide.pdf

Hello Jason

I've added a few comments on the doc in the sticky thread.

David

Thanks David, will have a read and add to document on the weekend.

Hi Jason,

Have you been able to do a comparison between the SPA3000 and the SPA3102 on the PSTN echo problem.

Cleve

Hi guys,

just got mine SPA-3102 over the weekend and so far, as per voice wise, it is as good as any I have ever tested (this includes, Netgear TA612V, Welltech 3502A and Welltech 3702A).

By saying so, I do find that the router side of things are good but then again, I found nothing to suggest that this is a firewall router and in particular the lack of any firewall protection such as SPI.

On the voice wise, I find that the router does restart like every day or so (don't know why and if is due to the internet hacking or whatsoever).

the QoS on this router is excellent... although I did have encounter some issues sometimes when downloading which I suspect that could be due to the limited bandwidth available from unwired network (suspecting only) as it happens sometimes and most of the time is good.

Now, I am trying and testing as to the different setup such as using the Linksys BEFSR41 to connect to internet instead for its support for Bandwidth management by the Lan Port which I can limit each port to 256 (I am on 512/128).

I also will be trying to use the TA612V as the main router too with perhaps, QoS turned off (coz I prefer the QoS on SPA3102) with DHCP turned off also (but good that this have SPI), connect this with BEFSR41 and let this as DHCP with bandwidth management turned on for assessing the WAN port on this unit, then I will have LAN 1 connect to SPA3102 and use the SPA3102 as voice adaptor only, I don't think the router side is as good when it compares with netgear with firewall. Lan 2 connect with a wireless switch which will be use to connect all computers and LAN 3 and 4 will not be used at all.

this way, I can separate the bandwidth for LAN 1 for VOIP, and LAN 2 for Computer network assessing the internet.

I did work well before when I was using the BEFSR41 as the main router (but no SPI) but it does require to restart every few days.... whereas the Netgear has been an excellent performer that I had it on months without having require to restart the router.

the SPA3102 restarts almost everyday.... or 30hours or so...

So, this is so hard to really find something that works perfectly but I do see that I am getting there to achieve something I wanted to do in order to enhance and to provide a guaranteed bandwidth for VOIP together with a computer networks that connects to the internet.

If this setting works without requiring a restart, then I can use this for business also and connect SPA9000 IP-PBX box to connect more phones... of cos, this will require faster internet also.

anyone with any better ideas? coz I do find it tough and non-sense sometimes that I have to connect that many different devices in order to achieve what I want to do.

thanks heaps.

Cheers,
Bosh

JMG Jason writes...

Pretty much same as SPA-3000; just with the added router. It seems to have T38 for fax but I don't use a fax machine so cannot test how well it works.

Good work Jason!

I'd be willing to try the fax option out, but I don't have the new model. ;(

Good job Jason :)

I'll see if I can get some of our clients who use the fax feature to post in here...

boshala writes...

the QoS on this router is excellent

Can you please describe the settings that you used to get this excellent QoS? I fiddled with it a bit but as soon as I uploaded a large file the voice quality went down to about 50%.. It was understandable on my end; but the callee said my voice was poorly effected.

the SPA3102 restarts almost everyday

I have had mine running for over a week and as far as I can tell it has not restarted. Do you mean it reboots or just loses the VoIP registration?

I do find it tough and non-sense sometimes that I have to connect that many different devices in order to achieve what I want to do.

agreed :)

If you can let me know your QoS settings on the SPA-3102 and anything else you did to make it work well that would be excellent. Also, can you try to upload a large FTP file somewhere and see how this effects your voice quality to the other party. Some feedback on that would be excellent.

Cheers,
Jason

Paul Warren writes...

I'll see if I can get some of our clients who use the fax feature to post in here...

Paul thanks for that :) I would love to hear about some fax experiences with this unit;

Also if you can get a few of them to report on the QoS that would be good. It seems a bit hit and miss to me. I would like it to be a bit more agressive in the way it handles throttling other traffic, so maybe if we can get a few settings from people we can see what works the best.

Cheers,
Jason

Regarding it resetting - does it reset and come back online automaticly?

I'm looking to put it into a "wife friendly environment", and if she needs to know how to reset the machine herself, then it'll suck :/ and i'll lose more hair.

PC - loved your docs, I'm thinking of ordering some stuff from you :)

Super Roach writes...

and if she needs to know how to reset the machine herself, then it'll suck :/ and i'll lose more hair.

Well the one I have connected does not reset/restart so I am not sure with what is happening with Bosh above.

If the unit did restart it should automatically reconnect though.. Have to wait for Bosh to give us some more info on the rebooting issue..

Thanks for the quick reply.

as with the restart, there has been more than 2 occasions I think 3 (and is only day 4 of the router in test and during which, I have configure and reconfigure the router in view of trying to get the best setting), the router just loses both VOIP lights... not sure if it is a registration of the lines but when I log on to the website admin site, I checked that the time elapsed were being refreshed to start from 0 so I suspect that not only were the voice, but the restart was for the router itself.

I am not sure whether if this was caused by any internet hacking activities or similar as this isn't a firewall router in the first place. So, I suspect that most people wasn't going to use this as a router anyway.

Don't get me wrong, it is good becoz it does quickly assign IPs to computers and back in operation within 10s... so fast.

as with the QoS settings, if I try calling from landline to VOIP's PSTN number, no matter how heavy the activities on the computer side, I can hear it very hear from the landline side (so, I suspect that whether upload or download, it doesn't affect much on the upload of the voice as it certainly does a much better job when compared with the TA612V. however, I do notice that sometimes and only happens to the VOIP side (where voice gets downloaded) that the quality drops but not as bad (still one the best so far).

I had the jitter set to high and when I set it to extremely high, it works every better without dropping much. so, I suspect that this does the trick abit.

notwithstanding that the problems I have encountered may well be caused by the fluctuation of the unwired signal and therefore causing the bandwidth fluctuate also.

I will see if this is the cause hopefully get it resolved before the weekend.

also I read it before, an article from Tom's hardware site on a I think Sipura spa-2100, in relation to the test on the QoS. links here: www.tomsnetworking.com/2...2/review_spa2100

they used the TBF type for QoS of this router and from the result of the test, it appears to be that TBF works better than CBQ.

so far, the voice, when used between VOIP and Landline, I have no problem from the landline side to listen very clear from the VOIP side with 729a (even better with 711u, just like PSTN to PSTN). the only problem I have encountered which drops I think 20-30% of the voice quality is for the VOIP side to listen which maybe also due to the fluctuation of the bandwidth provided by unwired.

will let you know if this is the cause...

but will see if my theory of integrating all the devices together to see if it works any good as I did have the BEFSR41 as main router and connect to the welltech and I allocated 256 to Lan1 and Lan2 and whatever activities I have on Lan2, I still maintain very very good voice quality with the welltech 3702A. so, if I can get it to do the same but with the SPA3102, i think it should be even better.

will keep you post.

Bosh

forgot to add that, I have both the SIP and RTP Cos values set to 5 ( I recall this being the highest out of all from 0-5 where 0 is normal and the priority goes from 0-5 with 6 & 7 being reserved for networking purposes... I learnt this after going thru the Cisco websites and reading tons of pages on the QoS and the terms and meaning of all these stuff etc...

guess what, just when I was typing this msg, my router restarted again... I do mean restart the whole router restart. now both voip lights are off.

my msn connection drops (using my wireless laptop right now connects to the wireless AP (turned off the DHCP))...

both voip lights still out.... but internet access is still working.

after some 2 mins, the voip lights comes back on... and my msn yes, is working again. now I don't know if any of you have ever encounter such a strange restart as it happens to mine at an interval of say, between 18hours to 30 hours... so, this is weird... I might consider to reset the router and set it all up again... 8(

Cheers,
bosh

what worse, the whole router, after the restart, lost the time, the date, everything are now back to 1/1/2003 12:00... *&&$(*#@% what's going on man?

anyone encountered something like this?

bosh

bosh,

Thanks for all the great QoS tips; I will try them out.

I am sorry your router is rebooting like that. Mine has been running (up time) 6 days and 13:15:19 Not sure what could be causing it.

with the time; have you got a time server in there? If it reboots the time will most likely get erased.. unless you put the time server in..

Let us know how your rebooting issue goes; did you get it from me? Sounds like it might be faulty. See how it goes and then if it keeps resetting I would consider trying to exchange for a new one..

What firmware version is in it?

Cheers,
Jason

thanks Jason,

I did have the latest firmware upgraded and I have just resetted back to default and own, just re-entered everything. hope this will last or I will have to send it back for an exchange as it makes no sense if one router restart everyday... as said before, my Netgear TA612v stays on like rocks... for months and months with no problem...

hope this will work out.

cheers,
bosh

forgot to mention, just incase you want to know, I tried both 729a and 711u and talk for an hour. the difference in terms of download and uploads, 729a uses about 3.6-3.8mb per hour of download (same size for upload) while 711u uses about 28-30mb per hour each direction. this is only for 1 line connection.

Wow bosh, that is a huge difference!

Thanks for that....

and I ordered the Op's ATA... lets see how it goes :)

i just did the sum just now, it works out to be that 711u uses about 8.33 kb/s or 66.64kbps (almost half of my 128kbps uplink provided 100% efficiency).

the 729a uses about 1.05kb/s or 8.4kbps (almost 1/8th of what 711u uses).

Ok, hope this will help for better understanding of QoS and how its get affected.

apart from the internet bandwidth, there are too many different types of QoS out there and finding one that fits your needs is all that matters.

to me, I found that having a Port QoS work best when you can selectively limit each port bandwidth and have all your computers on one Lan port while VOIP on the other. a kind of guarantee bandwidth.

back to the QoS on 3102, I use mainly TBF, now I have changed the SIP Cos value back to 3 (standard) as it is not so important as compare with RTP Cos value as this is the real value that applies to the voice packet (correct me if I am wrong). the default of 6 for RTP I have no idea why as far as I can understood that 6-7 are reserved for network purposes. 5 means critical and the lower the number, the less priority will be given when the data get pass the QoS gate. Of coz this is the on Chip QoS where you are solely relying on the chip to determine the packet header for their priority so therefore a better performance.

a good balance between the jitter (default high works great but if you have lots of users on your network, then, u may consider to change this it extremely high). this jitter is balanced against the packet size of the frame (which is normally classed as 10ms, 20ms, and so forth...)

So far that I am aware of, only Cisco and Linksys offers user the choice to change by 10ms at a time. on 3102, it is done by way of entering a value between 0.010 to 0.016 (i.e. 10ms, 20ms, to 160ms) under RTP packet size under the SIP tab.

please bear in mind that the bigger the frame size, the longer it takes to get pass and therefore a well balance between this and the codec and devices is needed.

just think of it as a cargo for transport... you could pack more into the cargo so therefore anything that falls within the cargo will be transported in one go and therefore the voice captured within that frame should provides a good voice quality but causes delay overall as it will take more time to transport.

the shorter the packet size, the faster the delivery but if the builtin QoS is not good enough (like the TA612V) or the internet connection signal or not enough bandwidth, regardless of which codec used or frame size, you may end up with bad voice quality due to loss packet... so it is extremely important that a well built QoS router can handle the loss packet and reduce it as much as possible.

I would suggest a value in between 20ms to 40ms are good. the lower the ms, the more cargo is required to transport the same packet (i.e. one 40ms will require two 20ms packet and therefore two headers overhead will have to assign to these packets and therefore increased the number of kbps usage).

you can test this yourself but surely the voice will be transported so much quicker with the lowest ms frame size. but 20-40ms are acceptable and will not be noticable on PSTN line.

then, there comes the delay caused by the codec, the delay of the voice packets get pass thru each devices connected along the path to the net (i.e. if you have your VOIP connected to a switch, then to a router etc) each device can add upto 10ms to the overall delay.

don't rely solely on what 3102 tells you the total round trip delay as it may not be accurate.

notwithstanding that our voice packets get sent to the voip providers server and then it gets encoded and decoded and forwarded and more forwarding before getting to its destination... so, sometimes, if bad quality, it may not be on your end but the voip server... you can try ping the server with say, data size between 32 to 1500 (1492 if dsl) depending on what you have set in your MTU of the router.

this MTU thing is not available on the 3102, but available on the BEFSR41 and most routers too... even the TA612V have it. the lower the MTU, the small the packet size allowed to go thru and therefore anything larger than this will either be dropped or repackaged into smaller size...

if voice quality is in issue, you may want to reset the size of this MTU to allow only upto say, 512. so, if a voice packets arrives after a data packet from computers, at the router and say it already started passing the gate, the voice packet only have to wait for the whole 512 to pass rather than the 1500 (almost 3 times the wait compare with 512) before the voice packet get pass the gate.

I personally don't believe too much on the on chip QoS like this but so far, the 3102 has been working quite good in terms of QoS ... but if you really want guaranteed bandwidth, you may need to go for a bandwidth management router which allows you to place a limit on each Lan port. this is exactly what i am trying to do and test.

but I think I will use the Netgear TA612v as the main router (for its reliability and SPI firewall), then connect the BEFSR41 to allocate the maximum uplink for each port so that the link between ta612v and befsr41 will be limited by the devices connected to the ports on the befsr41 so as to provide a guaranteed bandwidth for voip application.

will let you all know if this works well as i am still testing the restart problem on 3102 and see if it was due to torrent stuff. so right now, i have everything turned off and sit back and wait and see whether if the router still restart everyday.

hope this help as it did took me a few weeks of searching and reading materials off the internet considering I am not in the IT nor engineer area.

cheers.
bosh

Can anybody please tell me if I can use the new Engin Series III box for fax?? This is the ONLY thing really stopping me from getting it/Voip

Is the spa-3102 the device everybody refers to for the Engin voice box III - Im new to voip so pardon me.

I havn't heard anything about the Engin Series III voice box..

Well, I got my 3102 box.... I just got the internet active so thats good too.

I got it, and it arrived in a plain carton... no manuals or anything... bit harsh, but oh well, I got that from the internet..

So far I havn't been able to connect to it while it is connected to the router... Plugged in to the "ethernet" port to the router, which also has the cable modem and the pc plugged in.

(I havn't bothered routing the internet to the 3102 yet... I don't get any internet then!)

The voice guide is pretty neat when you dial **** from your analogue phone though!

Super Roach writes...

I havn't heard anything about the Engin Series III voice box..

www.staticice.com.au/cgi...q=voice+box+3+-2
staticICE :: voice box 3 -2 :
www.google.com.au/search...tnG=Search&meta=
DG834GV - Google Search

forum-replies-archive.cfm/561202.html
Engin Voice Box Series III out soon - Engin - Voice over IP

Super Roach,

Thats how the boxes come.. Thats why my setup guide is good :)

What seems to be the problem with getting the VoIP to function? Do you have the bluw ethernet cable going from your router into the INTERNET port on the SPA-3102?

Cheers,
Jason

Hey Jason, Thanks for the reply :)

And yes, your simplified guide is great :)

Currently, I have a Cable modem, a gigabit switch, and the voip 3102 box.

I am able to connect to its (the VOIP box) ip by directly plugging in from pc to the "ethernet" yellow connection... however I am not able to connect to the internet then.

I have tried plugging the cable modem into the "internet", and there is no internet connection for me - webpages will not load.

I can use the ivr (dialling ****) on the Phone plugged into it fine - and turned on web access just incase I could use that.

Currently, i have the VOIP box plugged into the switch, and the cable plugged into the switch. The voip box doesn't work, but at least I have the internet :) VOIP is getting setup tommorrow, so its only going to be important then...

FYI for other users - its almost definately not a hardware fault or anything like that, just a setup problem im having :)

*edit* it seems just swapping the cable over - so the cable is in the blue "internet" port, and the voip box is connected to the switch via the "ethernet" port has worked for internet access. However, I still can't access the actual box this way via my pc (I get a page cannot be found type error) - by both the internal ip and the webadmin type ip given to me by the IVR prompter.

Super Roach writes...

I am able to connect to its (the VOIP box) ip by directly plugging in from pc to the "ethernet" yellow connection... however I am not able to connect to the internet then.

Here is something I sent to Jason to add to his guide which might help explain what is happening:

Section 1 Step 2:

It might be worth clarifying that the cable from the ADSL modem/router should go into the port labelled "Internet" (blue).

If using the 3102 as a router, your PC goes in the yellow port labelled "Ethernet".

You do need to be aware that if you are using it as a router, the network number for anything connected to the yellow port will be different to what it was when connected to the ADSL modem.

For example, my original configuration was to have the ADSL router operate as a DHCP server for the network 192.168.0.*. The router was 192.168.0.1, and my computer was 192.168.0.10. When the 3102 is plugged into the ADSL router, the 3102 became 192.168.0.2 (or really, the blue port did).

I then plugged my computer into the yellow port. The 3102 then became a DHCP server for anything connected via the yellow port, using the network 192.168.1.*. (This is the address I got - it may depend on the network number used by the ADSL router.)

The yellow port got the address 192.168.1.1, and my computer became 192.168.1.2 using DHCP.

Now this has a lot of consequences. If you had manually set the address on your computer to something on the 192.168.0.* network, it will no longer connect to the Internet. It will now need an address on the 192.168.1.* network.

If you have your ADSL router set up to route incoming ports to your computer, the configuration will have to be adjusted for your computer's new address.

If you have the firewall on the ADSL router set up to restrict access to certain machines on your local network, this may also need to be adjusted for the new addresses.

Section 1 Step 8:

You will note from the above that the 3102 has two addresses:
192.168.0.2 for the blue port
192.168.1.1 for the yellow port

The web server seems to be automatically enabled if you connect to the yellow port's address from something connected to that port. (This is likely to be a security feature to prevent anyone on the Internet ever getting to the web configuration page. If you do enable the web server for the blue port to get the 3102 set up, it would probably be a good idea to disable it again after the configuration is finalised. A better option would be to configure the 3102 from something connected to the yellow port in the first place.)

Cheers

David

Ahh, this is crazy! I came home today after work... and heres what happened. The cable modem was plugged into the the VOIP box... no internet. I could however, access the voip box.

Plug the Cable modem into the Gigabit router... still no internet. That was very annoying. As soon as I unplug the voip box from the gigabit switch... yay, internet is back up.

AFAIK, The Motorola Surfboard SB5101 has no web interface for admin, and im sure the Gigabit switch has no web login to change settings neither...

I'm suprised I could be so confused out of plugging in two different objects :o

Because the SIP box 3102 has QOS for VOIP calls, ideally you would want it to be a router I guess as well...

If you want to get QOS for your voice, and your ADSL router does not support it, you need to have the cables configured like this:

ADSL router
  |
  |         ----------Phone handset
3102<
  |         ----------Phone line
  |
Ethernet switch
  |        |        |
  |        |        |
PC      PC      PC

The blue (Internet) port of the 3102 should be connected to the ADSL router.

Cheers

David

Good picture :) Thanks David.

The little problem Roach is having is the fact that he is using Neighbourhood Cable with a Motorola modem. The modem seems to be the issue.

At the moment we have got it working but not as you have described above. We have the Modem going to the switch and then the PC and SPA-3102 hanging off the switch.

WIth this setup his ISP has assigned an external IP address for the PC and also one for the SPA-3102. Its a bit weird. The modem does not have NAT so each device connected is assigned an IP address from the ISP. Its very weird..

We did some reading and what might have to be done is that modem needs to be switched off, then connect the SPA-3102 and then switch the modem back on. A few posts seem to suggest that the modem 'remembers' what was connected first, so I suspect this could be the cause.

Hopefully Roach can try this and get back to us.

Cheers,
Jason

Super Roach writes...

AFAIK, The Motorola Surfboard SB5101 has no web interface for admin,

Try 192.168.100.1 for admin page of the 5101.(I think been a while since i worked on them)

JMG Jason writes...

A few posts seem to suggest that the modem 'remembers' what was connected first, so I suspect this could be the cause.

In essence - yes.
Power cycle the modem (from the power source, not any build in 'soft' switches) and put the router between the modem and the switch and you should be on your way.

Firstly, thanks for the advice guys - I've been trying out a few different options with Jason. Currently, I just tried what David suggested. Cable modem is connected to the blue "internet" port, And the yellow "ethernet" port is connected to the switch. The pc is plugged into the switch, as is obviously the 3102.

There was no internet connection the pc could use, and when I tried to check the 3102's ip using the IVR prompter through the phone, it was listed as 0.0.0.0 .

So, to get back on the internet I have had to plug the 3102 into the switch via the internet port to be able to use sip and the internet... VOIP calls work this way, but obviously I lose out on the point of the 3102 :/

I have tried logging into the cable modem with the ip Lungy had (thanks for that lungy), and there are basically no options to change, besides turning off dhcp...

fyi - i did power off the cable modem and then plug it to the internet port of the 3102 when trying the above tips

Super Roach writes...

There was no internet connection the pc could use, and when I tried to check the 3102's ip using the IVR prompter through the phone, it was listed as 0.0.0.0 .

The Internet port of the 3102 is expecting to get an address via DHCP which would normally be done by a router. The fact that it is 0.0.0.0 would seem to indicate that it is not getting a response to its DHCP request when it boots.

Does the modem have a table listing its DHCP assignments? Perhaps it may only be able to handle one or two devices for DHCP?

So, to get back on the internet I have had to plug the 3102 into the switch via the internet port to be able to use sip and the internet... VOIP calls work this way, but obviously I lose out on the point of the 3102 :/

No QOS, which is why you got it....

fyi - i did power off the cable modem and then plug it to the internet port of the 3102 when trying the above tips

I suspect you need the sequence to be:

Turn off modem and 3102.

Plug it all together.

Turn on modem and wait a few seconds for it to get itself fully operational.

Turn on 3102.

Cheers

David

Just a note... I've got it working - and i think its fully working now. I only need to learn which QoS setting to use! lol...

Basically, I set the 3102's Lan ip address to 192.168.100.2 - 1 number after the cable modem (naturally I bumped up the dhcp address into this range as well for the 3102). This gives it a ip range inside the cable modems... viola, thats internet for it.
I also turned on "Multicast Passthru" in "application" for inbound and outbound, but I'm not sure what that is.

Inside WAN setup,
The qos setting is: (this is the big one I'm not sure about)
QOS QDisc: TBF (I'm not sure what TBF is, but I have that, None and CBQ to choose from). Because I want room for voip, I set the maximum uplink to 256Kbps (I'm on a 512kbit upload...)

Also DNS Server Order is set to DHCP, Manual.

Hi Guys,

I have got my SPA3012 and installed according to the user guide provided with it. But my Internet is not working on my PC. ATA's Wan port is getting the IP through DHCP. My PC can access ATA through LAN port but no Internet.
Internet (Optus)-- ADSL Modem--ATA--PC
I am using Optus Advantage 1500/256 ADSL and DLINK ADSL modem 302-G.

Can anybody help me , I am stuck with it for last 2 days.

Cheers,

Nadeem

Nadeem writes...

and DLINK ADSL modem 302-G.

You might have to enable NAT in the modem.. Have you done that?

Hi all

I recently decided to set up voip and my first attempt was not successful. I have a netgear DG834GT modem/router and tried to use a TAV612. I was experiencing the same problem as recent posts in this thread, i.e. when connected as per the instructions, I couldn't get any internet connection. After several days of trying differnt options I returned the TAV612 and figured the problem lay in having two routers, so I researched ATAs and decided the Linksys SPA-3000 should fit the bill. Got one on Ebay for $85 but the vendor has just emailed back and advised they are discontinued and offered a 3102 instead (if I pay an extra $29)

I am unsure if this is the way to go. Has anyone set up a 3102 with a modem/router successfully? I don't want to get one if it won't play with my current set up.

Thanks

Rob

selous writes...

Has anyone set up a 3102 with a modem/router successfully?

Yes, and got it working (eventually!)

Also, you can disable the 3102's routing functionality altogether if you are worried about that too.

Super Roach writes...

Also, you can disable the 3102's routing functionality altogether if you are worried about that too.

Or just don't use the port which exposes this functionality

dear all,

recall my post on the router crashes problems I used to have with the 2 linksys routers (BEFSR41 and SPA-3102) on daily basis, now i hve figure out that Linksys routers especially, and some other Dlink model as well, when used with bit-torrent (which sometimes creates lots of connections), it crashes the router as it either overloads it or whatever the reason maybe.

the cure to this is by setting your bit-torrent to under 200 connections instead and since, my router has been working fully with no more crashing and enable the port forwarding feature

I recall reading a site on this CBQ and TBF issue in learning the difference between the 2 and I cannot recall that site, but heres a link which may help you better understand the 2 and see which fits your type of network.

jost.web.cern.ch/jost/Pr...Yasu%20Paper.pdf

I am having the same problems mentioned above with getting both the router & ata components working together - but we'll get there eventually. My query is regarding T28. I assume this should come up as a codex option, but I can't see it there. Am I looking in the right place, or does the 3012 not actually have T28 capability.

Hi Jason,
I am experiencing the same problem as roach. I have a DG834g and SPA-3102. I do not seem to be able to access the net. I am not confident if my VOIP is working. I manage to call someone but I am not sure if it is doing it through my VOIP provider or through PSTN. I have set up the dial plan as per your recommendations in the guide.
How do I get the internet to work? I have it working with DG834G alone ... without the SPA3102.

Another question:
Does the SPA3102 neeed to be connected to a modem? Can it work as an ATA without a modem?

Thanks,
Angela

.

ischuros writes...

have a DG834g and SPA-3102. I do not seem to be able to access the net.

I have the same setup as you (DG834G and SPA-3102) and have no problems. Make sure the SPA3102 is plugged into one of the DG834G's ethernet ports, and the DG834G is connected as you had it before you got the SPA3102.

The problem is that both devices are routers, but only the DG834G is also an ADSL modem, so the DG834G should be the "master" router, and the SPA-3102 and all other PC's connected through it. I do not bother using the router features of the SPA-3102, and hence have nothing connected to they yellow "Ethernet" port on the SPA.

Additionally you will need to enable the "Web Interface" via dialling the appropriate code via your phone, see Jason's excellent guide.

To log into the SPA web interface once this is done, you will need to find the IP the DG834G has allocated to it. Log into the DG834g by typing:

192.168.0.1

Into your browser. Default Username is "admin" and Password "password".

Look under "Attached devices" and note the IP address the SPA has been allocated. You may want to reserve that IP for the SPA so it won't change when the DG834G reboots etc. Can't remember the exact menu to do this, but its pretty easy to find in the DG834G menu, just have a browse.

Once you have noted the IP address allocated to the SPA, just enter it into your browser and voila, your logged in.

Additionally you will need to add a Port-Forwarding rule to the DG834G to enable proper pass through of VoIP data. See www.portforward.com for more help on this.

Good luck

Thank you very much Ped ...
I set up as per your advice and internet and VOIP both works now!
Thanks you are Champ!

Pleasure ;-)

P.S. Sorry for the bad link its www.portforward.com

The ports are listed in this thread forum-replies.cfm?t=521128

Most of the VoIP providers I have tried work even if this isn't set, but a couple get one way audio without it.

Hello,
I have an spa3102 which works well with VOIP. The following is what I am thinking to do:
I have a PABX with 3 analog lines and currently line 1 is connected to line port of 3102. I would like to make 3102 a voip gateway for the other two lines (ie 2 and 3).

Currently the phone which is connected to the phone port of 3102 is working for VOIP calls. When I try to switch to the other lines with #9 to get PSTN line and then FLASH and 2 to reach line 2 or FLASH and 3 to reach line 3 then I only get PSTN line tone, no forwarding to lines 2 or 3 respectively. This is the first problem which occurs
However the phone which is also connected to spa3102 (on phone port) with extension 1 (connected to line port) can be reached from lines 2 and 3.

Secondly I am wondering if I can call from some other land line to the extension 1 of my PABX and then through a pin get a VOIP line to dial. However I still want to use extension of line 1 for PABX use and not to be a dedicated extension for VOIP use.
Can I do that? ie: call and if not using a pin, get extension 1 or, using a pin get the gateway to VOIP

Thanking you in advance

JMG Jason writes...

Anyway, you can view/download at www.jmgtechnology.com.au/spa_3102_guide.pdf